The District Weekly - Latest Comments in MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Eric — Wed, 29 Oct 2008 02:36:31 -0000

Hey guys, I agree with this....but what about Measure I? www.rebuildlb.com. I am for this ....

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Andrew Williams — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 15:18:51 -0000

"...if you commit a crime, we don’t really care whether you were walking your dog or freebasing your cat." What if I'm smoking marijuana for medical purposes, which is legal under state law but illegal under Federal law? Should I go to jail?
"Prop. 5 strips judges of the authority to do what their title demands they do from 9 to 5: make judgments." The Fed did that over 20 years ago by creating that loveliness known as "mandatory minimum sentencing." Talk about judges being stripped of authority. Passing Prop 5 just means that judges won't have to send drug users to jail. Aside from David Crosby, I don't know of a single drug ab/user who benefitted from time in the slammer.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Dave Wielenga — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 14:13:11 -0000

Hey John B....I might be in favor of the mandatory sentencing for those crimes by "gang-members" if we could expand the definition of "gang members" to include such "gangs" as the executive management structure at major corportations, university alumni associations, rotary clubs, etc.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

wswaim — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 11:41:47 -0000

JohnB: Thanks for understanding that, of course, I went to the heart of your question which was really (I figured) about how to reduce the prison/jail populations. Hence Three Strikes--which you credit with the falling crime rate in mid to late 90s; I notice that that trend coincides with (hey, hey) the Clinton economic boom. Could be, right? Could be that crime rises in tough times?

I can't assure you that drug users won't commit crimes, John B. But how about we agree that punishing drug users because they might commit another crime is kind of Philip D. Dick nightmarish. How about we just punish people for the crimes they commit, rather than criminalize behaviors we think MIGHT lead to crime? That jurisprudential philosophy (along with restoring the independence of judges, rather than tying their hands with sentencing requirements) could cut corrections spending dramatically. Now.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Judy C. — Wed, 22 Oct 2008 08:39:39 -0000

YES! ON PROP 2 --Food prices will not increase if Prop 2 passes. An analysis by a California based poultry economist show that it costs less than one additonal penny per egg NOT to confine egg laying hens in battery cages. It may increase consumer prices a few pennies per dozen. It is worth a few cents more to decrease animal cruelty! Prop 2 will not take effect until 2015, giving farmers plenty of time to make the transition.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

What's_in_a _name? — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 17:31:13 -0000

I think changing one's stance is more admirable than saving face and clinging to a previous poorly made decision. Well done, Will.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Will Swaim — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 16:41:51 -0000

I'd immediately rescind the Three Strikes law--it's a financial disaster for the state--legalize many drugs, regulate others and wipe out drug offenses.

It's been fun being all three branches of government for the last 60 seconds! Peace out.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Brown Dude — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 16:13:23 -0000

You guys are clowns for not supporting prop. 12.

I got an Idea. How about a publication that supports the institution (military) that actually VOLUNTEERS, SWEARS, TRAINS and FIGHTS to defend the Constitution, including the amendment that keeps your bills and paychecks paid. Did you stop to consider the National Guard of this state? Better hope that shit never hits the fan in the LB.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Dwight K Snider — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 14:41:34 -0000

Ok, it’s time to cut the crap! We have a very important election before us. How about a simple yes or no-list from the District Weekly of all the candidates and propositions on the November 4th ballot telling us, the people, how you want us to vote. I don’t want to have to think this stuff through. Just tell me how to vote. It’s your job to inform the public -- just do it! Make it easy! Give us, the people, something we can copy, print and take to the polls on Election Day. All I really want to do is vote, get my “I Voted” sticker then go to the bars and get my free drinks. Why does the District Weekly have to make everything so complicated

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Andy — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 12:56:55 -0000

Wow. I had no idea editorial decisions were so, um, physical in nature. Never saw that on Lou Grant.

And there is nothing unAmerican regarding changing your mind based on new information. For instance, I now think Johnny Depp is a fine actor and that Brussles sprouts are delicious.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

wswaim — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 12:47:42 -0000

Andy: There was nothing easy about this change. Griley kicked me in the testicles while Dave Wielenga and Theo Douglas worked my kidneys. Food critic Miles Clements cooked the testicles and one kidney (diced) in a lovely red-wine and shallot reduction, strained it . . . . is this going anywhere?

But seriously: You sound good shouting "hold the presses."

And seriously seriously: the problem with measures--including this year's--is that voters are working in zero-gravity, without context. For instance, I'd argue that, contrary to Prop. 6, we should reduce dramatically the number of crimes that require a prison sentence (or even jail) and use the savings (in new prison construction and corrections budget) to build something really useful like a railroad (of course, we could go back to the 19th century and use prison labor to build railroads). But only legislators could work that sort of budgetary and political magic; we use the referendum system to treat discrete symptoms with, like, no attention to how this stuff is interconnected.

And I understand that--um, what did you call it?--flipping on an issue is un-American (along with changing one's mind when presented with new information, striving for a superior education, language skills). And I know you're not saying this, Andy. But too many papers, pundits and politicians (pardon the alliteration) chain themselves to positions and declare themselves unmovable. Open-mindedness, pragmatism used to be the hallmarks of what passed for American philosophy; now our philosophical code is stubbornness dressed up as moral rigor.

And let me just add one last thing, Andrew: I really admire your comments. Thanks for them.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Judy C. — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 11:43:55 -0000

PROP 2 --REGARDING FOOD PRICE INCREASE: An analysis by a California- based poultry economist show that it costs less than one addional penny per egg NOT to confine laying hens in battery cages. It MAY increase consumer prices a few pennies per dozen. Isn't it worth a few
cents more to decrease horrific animal cruelty?
PROP 2 will not take effect until 2015, which gives California producers plenty of time to transition to humane end environmentally friendly production systems. More humane treatment of farm animals improves food quality and safety.
PROP 2 is better for the animals, people and the environment!

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Andy — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 10:40:07 -0000

Oh, and I've always wanted say "Hold The Presses!"

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Andy — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 09:56:36 -0000

WHOA, WHOA, WHOA, there...hold the presses if you're going to flip on the issues that easily.

Now I totally understand the fiscal crisis argument AND the very valid philosophy behind not borrowing your children's money, but Prop 1A is an infrastructure bond that has tangible economic benefits to the state immediately...i.e., jobs, which are going to be harder and harder to find. Plus, there is a potential revenue stream or tangible asset to sell once completed.

While bonds for education and puppies are no less important, in times like these jobs and consumer spending will pull us out of this mess.

Please don't flip so easily on this issue by lumping all bond measures in one big sack.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Greggory — Tue, 21 Oct 2008 04:19:57 -0000

Will, didn't I just say vote YES on 5?! Now you're supposed to change The District's position, and that's that! Okay, seriously, while Prop. 5 obviously isn't a true fix, by lessening even a few of the penalties imposed under a bad set of laws, it lessens the injustice done by those laws. Even if Prop. 5 does NOTHING else, it seems to me that alone makes it worth voting for. And while it might not make any difference to most of us, it certainly might make a big difference to an unfortunate few. After all, as Thomas Merton says... (Inside joke. Apologies to anyone else who read this.)

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

wswaim — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 19:25:15 -0000

Some really great points raised here. We were considering what a number of you (LB City Girl, John B, DWR) said about bond debt, and you're right. So in the print edition we're changing our recommendation on Prop 1A. We love the trains, but this ain't the year to add more debt. Like LBCG, we absolutely despise the spend-and-debt mentality that drives so much of California's politics.

John B: You pick the easiest crime statute to trace when you choose murder--which was illegal in California before the establishment of state statutes, before California was a republic, under the Spanish and (I'm now guessing) probably frowned upon in aboriginal cultures. Prop 6 isn't asking Californians about anything so obvious as murder. Or slavery. Or wife-rapists. I think we can agree that those are pretty much universally reviled, and that we're not talking about those. What is it in Prop 6 that you'd regard as, like, lawmaking on a level with murder/slavery/rape? I'm not seeing it.

Greggory: Please, god, really, the communication on drug-treatment is already so complicated that we don't want to start hauling cardinal-colored, really malodorous fish across the issue. Prop 5 assumes the law is just. Naturally, if a law ain't just, Prop 5 won't do anything to fix that.

Favorite line thus far: Animal Lover's question.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Judy C. — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 19:04:05 -0000

Hi Animal Lover: Prop 2 applies to calves raised for veal, breeding pigs and egg-laying hens. These animals are kept in dirty, cramped cages, gestation crates and battery cages their entire lives! They are virtually immobilized and prevented from their natural behavior. All animals deserve humane treatment! Animals raised for food account for 98% of all animal abuse!
PLEASE EVERYONE, VOTE YES ON PROP2!

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Kate K — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 17:49:43 -0000

For Animal Lover: Hi, Animal Lover, and thanks. Yes, it applies to domestic animals raised as food providers, specifically laying hens, pigs and veal calves. The guys raised a good point in their intro when they wondered if this would only give the hens room to turn around, but there's bound to be more to it than this, particularly since the laying cages are one atop the other and not only are the poor hens confined like the woman at the end of Todd Browning's "Freaks" but also the ones on the bottom are covered in chicken#@&%. Just like humans, in real life. But as everyone can figure, even if you're not going to buy the yummy vegan stuff (and much of it is) that substitutes for chicken and other meats, why add horrible conditions like these to their death? To paraphrase what one of the Humane Society members--I think it was WAyne Pacelle--said, they're making the ultimate sacrifice by dying in order to feed us.
Thanks for being an animal lover, Animal Lover. For info on this proposition, visit www.yesonprop2.com.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Judy C. — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 16:56:10 -0000

Thanks for voting "YES" on Prop 2!!!

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Judy C. — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 16:54:23 -0000

Thanks for voting "YES on Prop 2!!

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Animal Lover — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 16:48:00 -0000

I'm confused about Prop 2. Does it apply only to animals raised for food, or does also apply to animals that live as 'domestic partners'?

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Andy — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 14:58:04 -0000

After reading (and re-reading) Prop 4, it seems that after passage, it is in a physician's interest to go nowhere near a minor and their pregnancy, as the ultimate legal outcome will be placed on their doorstep. Abortion provider insurance will surely increase after the passage of this measure, as the onerous verification requirements in this bill will likely negate a minor from seeking and obtaining proper notification (through the courts) or other provider, and they will likely just attempt to get around these one way or another.

And it seems that the whole "predator" angle is merely an attempt to tie this to the most reprehensible members of our society.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

DWR — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 14:40:50 -0000

You and I are seem to be perfectly aligned, LBCG. I too say YES on 2 and 11, and NO on everything else.

I don't eat babies for breakfast but I also sometimes get annoyed with the "we have to do it for the children regardless of cost" mentality.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Kate Karp — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 14:20:29 -0000

What's wrong with beating the perp to death? Sure would help the overcrowding problems in jail. Note that this doesn't apply to victimless crimes. Too bad this prop doesn't allow it.

Re: MAD PROPS! THE OFFICIAL DISTRICT WEEKLY STATE PROPOSITION VOTER GUIDE

Greggory — Mon, 20 Oct 2008 03:26:53 -0000

Yeah, you're a bit nuts about advocating No on 5. You really believe in "do the crime, do the time," even if the law is bad? So, like, where there are sodomy laws on the books, you'd be AGAINST minimizing the penalties that could be imposed on two consenting adults who happen to favor a certain type of sex? Look, the "War on Drugs" is worse than a failure: it impinges on basic civil rights. Prop. 5 is one step to lessen the impact of bad laws and a failed policy. Oh, and as far as what it lets judges do, maybe you missed this analysis by Superior Court JUDGE Jim Gray? "Under Prop. 5, judges make the call as to which nonviolent offenders get into treatment and which don’t. [...] Nothing in Prop. 5 prevents judges from sentencing dangerous offenders for the crimes mentioned by opponents. Prop. 5 is a good law that preserves judges’ discretion and gives us new powers to hold offenders accountable during drug treatment." YES on 5, please.